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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello.Ive been waiting for the new focus RS for the last yr now and am getting fed up with waiting and have decided to look at a lancer EVO 6.I just need a few views on which to buy.The car will be used on the track.Im looking at an extreme soon which ralliart have? How reliable are these as i currently own an RS500 and dont want to be worrying about it breaking every 2 mins due to the extra power.Or i was think the Rs sprint as this seems more than fast enough for using on the track and on the rd.
Ive seen some performance figures on the Ralliart site for the RS but how accurate are they ? rg 0-100 etc.

Thanks for any help
 
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Jason

Firstly, welcome. Many are fed up with the wait for the RS. I find it interesting at how people are prepared to wait for a car on a promise...........

Anyway, to the questions! Which extreme are you looking at? If it is the 7 Extreme S, this car is awesome. If it is one of the RS450's, great cars with strong engineswith lots of potential. You are paying for the name, but it should hold its value better. People will say they are overpriced. However, you will get it back when you come to sell. If you are worried about reliability, yet again a Ralliart car could be what you want because of the warranty they give. Even then, a standard 6 or RS is a realiable car with a couple of problems only. If you are going to do trackdays, you will want to get upgraded brakes because the standard Brembos have a reputation for warping. In the UK the favoured brakes are AP while in Europe there are fans of Movit.

Once you think of modifying a car, and you will once you have owned it for a while!, then there are various mods to look for. Engine wise, there is a lot of debate as to whether you need to upgrade the ARP bolts ( an easy job costing about £200 I think). Although I don't see a lot of evidence to support the need for thjis mod, it is cheap enough to do anyway just for piece of mind. If you want to run high boost, then most people will recommend forged pistons and conrods (like the RS450's from Ralliart). There are other reasons for them, such as lower compression ratios. However, overall the Evo is one of the stronger performance cars around, so long as it has been properly serviced.

As for performance figures, these miss the point of Evo ownership. Are they accurate? Well as accurate as any of these type of figures can be. I am certain that all figures quoted have been done by some tester at some point in time. Ralliart are always giving cars to mags for testing. But as I have said, this misses the whole point. The Evo is, quite simply, about the fastest point to point car you can buy. Well, certainly unless you are prepared to pay 2 or 3 times as much. It is because of 2 factors; between gear accelaration (30-70 for instance) and the handling.Most journalists accept that little will touch an Evo on country roads, including Porsches, Farrarris and any othe exotica you care to mention. On a track it isn't much different. Evos have a reputation for seeing off more than a few very expensive machines :D

Don't misunderstand me. A standard Evo can always be improved and if you want to do trackdays, then you will want to improve suspension, brakes and finally, engine. However, in even basic form, you will find it hard to do better. Sure, there are cars like the Elise and Caterham (just to prove I can give a ballanced opinion) but I presume from your enquiry that these don't appeal. Go test one soon!
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi simon

im looking for a car which like you say is good through the gears.Ive asked a few people what they thought but these have been fellow RS owners and they say the EVO was sluggish in the mid range,which i find hard to believe.
Having had an escort cos then going for the RS500 caterhams and lotus's dont do it for me,and the EVO has that kind of practical appeal aswell.
I was thinking about buying a standard EVO 7 but the 6 does appeal a bit more,and id have some loose change to mod it.I was looking at the EVO 6 xtreme ralliart have at moment 31k i think.Do you think maybe it would be more sensible to buy a standard GSR,or RS sprint and mod it myself ? i do like to play with cars a bit,and me sisters boyfriend has a TVR cerbera so i have a point to prove there.
I believe the gearing is slightly different on the RS to the GSR,will it make a noticable difference when driving it on the rd ?
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
evo sluggish in mid range???? must be thinking of a scooby. On my TME there is very little turbo lag and the car goes hard from 2500rpm.

The RS is low geared (~110mph top end) and would be too thrashy for long distance driving. great for track tool or b road heroics though.

31k is too much for any e6 (except maybe blades). In your position i would get a newish tme for ~£23k and spend the rest of your money on mods:-
decent suspension £4-5k
AP 6 pots £2k
exhaust/filter £1k
GEMS or PE ECU plus tuning £2k

Should see you making 350 ish hp maybe more. Still wouldn't scare TVR in the dry in a straight line but you'd have him otherwise.
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Looks like i will give the RS a miss then.110 aint even fast enough for the track.The xtreme already has AP brakes,coilovers so i guess id almost spend the same modding a standard one if thats what i did.
Whats different about the Makinnen model,is it cosmetic or are there engine differences aswell ? i personally prefer the standard front bumper on the 6.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Jason

An Evo, slugish? Well everything is relative. I know that the big engined Cossie boys night say that but if you want to sit on a straight road at 40 mph and then boot it, I am sure the cossies would be faster and better. However, I always enjoy a series of corners and a Cossie. I slow down so as to watch the fun of them trying to keep up :D

Now a bit more serious. I can only see Extreme RS450's for sale at Ralliart for that kind of money. The engine work alone on that car is about £5K. It has some no performance value extras, such as bodywork, which just make it look good. However, overall a great package. As for top speed of an RS being 110 mph, I don't think so. The last one I drove was doing 5000 rpm at 100mph and I seem to have followed a car with RS gearing at 140mph ( on a track or in Germany, of course;)). IMO for your needs an RS based car would be best.

As for cost opf mods, for trackwork you need both front and rear AP's. 6 pot and bigger disks on the front and 4 pot on original disks at the rear. Cost? £2500. Finally, if it is an Extreme RS450, don't worry about your sister's boyfriend. Your straight line will be only a little down (maybe?) but you will have your foot to the floor coming out of a corner a long time before he has finished dialing out the opposite lock! and in the wet........ :D

But go and try one. Don't take our word for it.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Cheers simon thats what i wanted to hear.
I live in the south and use my car to travel to london most weekends so i need a bit of go.Im of to the geneva motorshow in march to see if anything catchs my eye,but im sure nothing will be able to equal the EVO,for the price and speed.I much prefer the feel of 4wd as my Rs500 has me worrying at most corners,and its had new brakes suspension etc.Like you say the body mods have no reflection on the power but it does give the xtreme a little if your face....LOL dont they all really.

I will let you know how i get on with my test drives and like you say it does come down to personal experience,and how you feel about the car.
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
If you get an extreme, you will still have to buy suspensions. I would personally try and get them with the car at a better price.
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I believe top speed of the lo ratio RS is roughly high 130's, low 140's as Simon says. All Japanese cars are electronically limited to 180kph (112mph) which explains the confusion.

Unless I am mistaken and they have used library photos of a different car on the Ralliart site then the white RS450 Extreme they have for sale has been dynoed at 345bhp and 369lbft. The graph of the run is at http://www.tuningjapanese.co.uk - V11 RAG.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
just been looking on the Ware garage web site and they have an EVO 6 Rs ll. Is this just a newer version of the RS or has it got a few extras on it ?
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
you can buy mine for the right price black evo6
dms suspension ap 6 pot front ap 4 pot rear
rc developments 400hp pack stainless manifold cams rod bolts etc etc etc the list goes on and on and on . oh and you can have the wife to ha ha ha
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Hi Jason
So your selling your 500 m8 Oh sorry welcome M8, you are copying me lol, I want an EVO 6 aswell, Ford have got nothing to offer me, with bhp and the focus forget about it m8 for a start is only going to be FWD not 4x4, there is no sence it that at all !
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Jason- if i were you this is what i wuld do:

you should bypass the gsr's and get either:

a 6 RS2

I would say the 7 rs sprint but the lower gearing won't suit your long jorneys. Okay so it'll only do 140mph but it WILL get there bloddy quick and its not everyday that you do snetterton (and thats the ONLY curcuit where you could argue that will need 140|PLS|). A 6 RS2 will have 2.2 quick rack (better feel), no AYC (more adjustable and more of a drivers car), is lighter and has teh bigger titanium turbocharger (nopt to be confused with samll one on teh TME) which is better to tuning. You could then have some serious fun tuning it to whatever you like. A new RS2 will now cost you about 24K as there are a few left so for a total of 30-32K you can have a serious EVO (350bhp |PLS|) with all teh right brakes and suspension on it :)


7 RS

you could wait for one fo these but i'd personally sooner go for the above. The 7 rs will cost you about 27, 28K when it arrives and as i understand it still has AYC as wellas ACD which i am trying to avoid.(i currently have a 6 gsr). Will need tuning as well on top of that as well as brakes and suspension if you want to track it.


Ralliart Special 6

instead of doing teh 6 RS2 and custom modding it you could do a one stop solution by buying a secondhand 6 Extreme or RS450 off of them. Benefit is that it will always have more inherent value than an RS2 |PLS| lots of mods, but it won't be new and amp; you won't have the fun of tuning it bit by bit yourslef (unless you tune it even further). Whilst the RS450 has good torque, the extreme is down on power for what it is but they are both very comprehesive conversions with AP brakes and engine strengthening as simon says. They would be seriosuly reliable i reckon but the RS450 does nmot really drive like an everyday car from what i have heard.


Ralliart special 7

this is your final option. Its the most up to date one and teh most expensive but again you lose the fun of doing it all yourself over time but have the benefit of warranty. ALso, teh extreme 7 and E S 7 are both very nice looking cars ino wheras the standard 7 hasn't quite got it.



ME: well if i have a momment of madness and am feeling rich in teh next few weeks then i'm getting teh 7 rs sprint 'cos i love no-compromise cars and ridiculous close ratios ! But the more likely option is a 6 RS2 - serious deal on one of the last 6's available. THere will also be something quite poetic about having a 6 with one of those funny new registrations !!! :) :). If you want to know my mod plans, go back a few pages and look for help me plan my mods thread.


regards


R
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
jason, just read the thread properly - you said you prefer a 6. Then either:

new RS2 for 24k and 6-8k of mods
ralliart used rs450/extreme

i have been pondering the same question of late.

its a tough call. If you spend 1.5k on ap front brakes, 1k exhaust and amp; induction, 2k high boost then thats 4.5K gone and you still have money for suspension but you'll only be around 350bhp, same as an extreme and probably a bit slower than an RS450. You'll certainly be slower than a cerbera in straight line but midrange will be good. Remember that for price of ralliart special you still have 1.5-3.5K left so you could use that to do cheaper fast road/track suspension and then pistons, conrods, cams, ~380bhp ish. Then you'll be v. fast.

Bear in mind also that RS2 does have aircon and amp; elec windows but the seats are CRAP and you 'll need to get proper recaros or teh race recars like they put in the RSX./Extreme.


let me know what u do
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
jason - sorry, one last thing (im kind of typing this cos im in sam eposition and clarifying my own thoughts)

you could get a low mileage used TME (makinen), nice complete package and benefits of 2.2 quick rack, funky interior but although im NOT an expert (more an information hoover ) it appears that RS is better for tuning and developing cos it has lightwight and larger turbocharger. ALso TME has AYC and ABS which i personally don't want round a track.

oh, and the car pictured on waregarage webiste is a TME RS which you wont want cos it has close ratio box and even more basic interior than RS2 with NO aircon and wind windows. No sound deadening i think as well :-o


regards
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Cheers for all the advice guys.Im going to ralliart soon for a long weekend so i can get a chance to drive a few of em and try to come to a decision.Im also going to a few trackdays soon and hopeing i might be able to have a few goes in the odd EVO.

I do like the thought of modding my own car,but i am at the point of buying a house so i could see me throwing money at that instead of the car......hmmmmm bloody women..!

I also saw the review of the EVO 7 RS which looked mighty impressive but i still prefer the inyour face appeal of the 6.
 
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