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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have heard so many people on this board talk about things thay clearly dont know about. I am the owner of M and amp; M Racing and I will now share with you How you mitsubishi turbo's work:

1. I have an Evo 1. I was told earilier on this board that I had a boost controll solonoid... I do not. The evo on ( and maybe 2 |PLS|3( dont know never seen them)) runns a 'Closed loop boost'.

It is essensially controlled by 3 points :
1. The actuator
2. The ( if any) restrictor
3. The dump valve !!?!!

The actuator on an evo 1 it set to 'chatter' at a certain boost level, i think is is round 16-18 psi, this is when i starts opening up the wastgate to let gasses bypass the turbo PROpellers.

The restrictor if any, ie a bleed valve, or in the mitsi case a restriction valve, stops pressure going to the actuator adn opening the wastgate. the pressure is taken from a tee from the pipe coming from the plenum chamber ( by the injectors)

The dump valve IS a bit of a saftey mechanism, recirculating the air back into the beginning of the induction system at around 10psi, maybe even 12 if your lucky.

Closed loop boost means it is a closed system, no ECU intervention ie, no boost solonoid.

If people still dont understand or 'get it' or ever dont believe me, i can draw you some diagrams if you like..... and post them.!

So now that is settled alow me to demonstrate....

My turbo with the boost control pipe fully closed will boost at around 18psi by the engine only sees 10-12. It is capable of this... just.... that is why it is matched with the appropriate actuator! I have put an EVO 6 recirc, dump valve on rated to leak at 18 psi, they leak for a reason people.... So you dont blow up your engine.

I can now flow 18 psi into the engine b4 the BOV leaks boost back into the air system. By tuning around the valse (as suggested on this board) will increase the boost because the valse is not operating... and the chatter you hear (with an airfilter fitted) is compresser stall on the turbo.... very very bad, more lag, more tubo wear... no question.

I have spent much of my life (im 25) racing NA and Forced induction, i do know what im talking about. if you think I dont then please ask, but just because it may conflict with what you have heard before, dont laugh... ask and i will explain.. I also have one of the biggest tuning companies in the land to back me up ( not M and amp; M) they are the best... adn no i dont mean Power Eng' wouldnt give them a mini to tune, but hey each to thier own.

So questions please. I will answer them all, I also am very knowlageable may othe car subjects. I know im only 25 but been racing since I was 8. I know my ****....

OK let the games begin..

PS im dislexic so cant spell to well. Sorry

M
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
That is the cockiest post I think I have ever witnessed.

What planet is this guy on?

Go buy a workshop manual - you won't have to draw your own diagrams then.
And you might be able to learn a little before you go gobbing off.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
EVO 1 Owner, who rattled your cage? If you are so unhappy, don't use the forum - simple.

I am sure you are a wonderful person, even if you are only 25 (?!?!?!?)

Which country are you from - didn't sound like the UK. Reads almost like an advert for your business.

As for your comment about Power Engineering, I suggest you take a look at my car http:/homepage.ntlworld.com/tony.rodriguez before you open your mouth - and explain to me exactly how my car came about, which is probably the fastest EVO in the country (almost definitely).

I am all for information and constructive criticism, but I think we can all do without arrogant posts like this. If you want to advertise your business, go ahead.
If you want to offer some knowledgeable information, go ahead.

To me, your comment Let the games begin indicates that you just want to cause trouble.

Don't want to start a fight with you, but your post reads like you want to start a fight with everyone here!
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Damn, I've been wrong all this time - I should have realised that a bleed valve (not that I'd want one on an EVO - boost controller maybe!!) was a restricting device - silly me ;)

M - you're going to find out very quickly just how much knowledge is on this board but most people are very reserved when giving their credentials. Sit back and learn :)

ps - My EVO 1 has an actuator on it. Do you have any history on your car - it could be that a previous owner has modified the wastegate plumbing and removed the actuator.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Like I said my Evo 1 does NOT have a boost control solonoid... come and have a look if you like!

And as for the guy who said about bleed valve being a restrictor, yes it is a restrictor on my evo one. I was only talking about the evo 1... in case you forgot.
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I have a few questions that with your technical knowledge of mitsi turbos you will hopefully be able to answer.

Can you explain how I can 'blow up my engine' with a reversed dump valve. I do understand how they work and I understand what reversing them does but I'm interested in the technical description of what leads to what and how this results in a blown up engine.

And can you also explain how the secondary air system on my Evo works because that is a similar setup to my BOV but I don't understand it...

Awaiting your reply with baited breath

Andy
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Later (boost ecu controlled evos) will not be in danger as they have a fuel cut mechanism, controlled by the MAP sensorattached to the ECU. Maybe even the evo 2 onwards does I dont know.

But lets say for argument sake that you reversed factoru BOV was working perfectly, ie no leaks... by reversing it, it can not vent pressure back to the biginning of the induction cycle, so IF... and IF, your actuator pipe was crushed, in effect giving you unlimited / much higher boost, the air flow meter / fuel pump / injectors / ecu may not be able to cope with that amount of extra air and run lean. If that happens on high engine load, ie 4-5th gear flat out, you aint got long untill det.

Very bad explaination, i was assuming you know about det and over boosting and AFM's

As for your secondary air system, please couyld you explain what exacitily you mean, I woiuld like to know, i take it you dont mean the aircon!!!

Sorry if i sounded a bit arrogent but I am not, an I would never advertise my business on this board, as I have nothing to sell!!!!

I just am trying to help people understand how missinformation can make you sound a bit .... well.... misinformed.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Evo1Owner, correct me if I'm worng but....
Bearing in mind that the dump valve only opens when the throttle is closed (vacuum pressure in the plenum opening the diaphragm on the valve), if you have a problem with the actuator and run high boost then the dump valve won't save your engine from overboosting because the valve won't be open when the throttle is open i.e 4th/5th gear flat out because you will have high pressure on both sides of the diaphragm.
The dump valve is there to protect the turbo and airflow meter from the reverse flow of air that is generated when the throttle is quickly closed (before the turbo stops generating boost) and is not there to protect the engine from overboosting.

The secondary air system is on the later Evo's as another method of venting the excess air pressure but it vents into the exhaust manifold rather then into the induction system. I was only asking to verify how much info on the Mitsi turbo system you actually knew.

Andy
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Well I know bug all about how the E1 controls its boost. And I'm not even going to step into this can of worms. However, perhaps you would be able to make a suggestion about another E1 aspect that puzzles me. (This isn't a test question or anything - I'm genuinely interested in find a method/solution.)

The E1 as standard as 210' castor.... Can you think of anyway (after looking at your car) to increase that to say around 350' ?
And do you think the 23mm front anti-roll bar is too thick ? (Considering the rear is 18mm)

TonyC
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Later (boost ecu controlled evos) will not be in danger as they have a fuel cut mechanism, controlled by the MAP sensorattached to the ECU. Maybe even the evo 2 onwards does I dont know.

All the evos and even the earlier VR4 (and late Starions) have a built in Fuel Cut programmed into the ecu. It works from the MAF (Mass Air Flow sensor) signal - when the ecu sees too high an air flow from the MAF output it cuts the fuel flow instantly - Fuel Cut.

There is no MAP (Manifold Absolute Pressure) sensor on any Mitsubishi ecu'ed car. Only Mitsi's with aftermarket ecu's use a MAP sensor to calculate air flow.

It sounds very much to me that your boost control solenoid has been removed and replaced with an aftermarket bleed valve. My old VR4 has the same where the useless main dealer snapped off one of the legs of the solenoid valve and glued it back on - filling the valve with epoxy resin in the process. I have replaced it with a bleed valve and it allows me to select my boost for economy or fun (10-16psi). Fuel cut at around 18psi.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Some of you guys are as bad as one onother for firing up ,at what is regarded as an insane posting .
Also read the last line of EVO1owners post .he describes himself as dilexic ,some of you missed that.
I read the post as him not saying what he had but a description of what could be done.
the average person intakes only 5% of what is said during comunication .the most is done with gesticulation.
Can't wait for video screen postings to be available easily and cheeply.then we can stick our fingers up at one another.
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Rightio, I know bug all but I do have eyes :D and a car. I've had a look at my E1 (which is totaly as factory). The actuator is not controlled by a tee'd pipe coming from anywhere near the plenum. The pipe slots between the intercooler exit and return piping (which is all on one side on the E1-3) and attaches to a small (almost tiny) controller mounted beneath the battery. Where it goes from there is anyones guess -I'm not that bendy and I can;t take my eyes out and place them on my fingers :) but its not the plenum.
The only tee coming from anywhere near the plenum controls the recirc-dump valve.

If you want me to look at anything else in particular to help you work out what is going on with your E1, just ask.

TonyC
E1-3 register secretary
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
i like the kid !
at least his made up name isnt pretentious !
i may sponsor him to do a few track days..........could be interesting for certain people !
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I was just wandering what my Apexi boost controller is hooked up to. Also when I got fuel cut becuase my SOLANIOD (I am dsylexic) got stuck open I must have dreaming. Funny that I own a 1800 RS, the one before the Evo 1.
lots of love and kisses
al
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
OK, I never claimed to be an expert, just thought I could help. My original point about the boost solenoid was qualified by
unless you've removed it and replaced it's functionality with some other device
added after you said you didn't have one and this looks to be the case.

As other have pointed out, your car should have a solenoid, if the previous owner was wise enough know that by taking it out he/she would improve things then fine, but you do seem to a have a few problems.

and amp;lt;sadowitz and amp;gt;Coincidence or Magic? You decide! and amp;lt;/sadowitz and amp;gt;

:D
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
hmmm,howya!

Dislexia is no excuse for ignorance. Seems like you've a bit of growing up to do boy.
It's a bit sad posting a question just to try and make idiots of guys who just want to help:(
Look and learn!
Chunky tried to tell you ;)
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
NOW SAY SORRY YOU'VE JUST BEEN GSRED!
LOLOLOLOLOL!

I think its called getting your facts right in the first place before shouting your mouth off (don't worry, we all do it now and again;)). Just because your Evo 1 doesn't have a boost solenoid it doesn't mean that all Evo's 1 don't.
I hope you are not too shinged by the flames and I look forward to your next posting ;)

Paul,
;)
 
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