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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is a little off subject but has any one read about or even tried the New civic type R .
I believe its 200Hp and 196 Lbs/ft torque and at 16K a pretty good value for money vehicle .
I also beleive that the civic R even old shape has good handling capabilities.
looks abit old fashioned still and a little of a granny car .
 
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Awesome little tool, for similar money the Skoda Octavia RS is pretty hot aswell!
15k buys alot these days!
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I have considered both but the Octavia depreciation is terrible, wait 3 years and get it for £5k! It would make a great Q car though if tweaked to 225bhp. It might be worth doing it in 3 years time ;)
I will arrange a test drive in the Civic soon, by the way it is 196bhp (200ps) and 144lbft torque not 196lbft (wish it was though!). Thats a power to weight ratio of 164bhp/ton (Lotus Elise 158bhp/ton!). The 6-speed box is supposed to one of the best there is on any car. The second generation VTEC engine has an improved torque range over the outgoing Integra with the usual VTEC redline! The handling is supposed to be great although not as good as the Integra. The only trouble is the looks, MPV meets Max Power! The first 150 Type-R's have just been shipped to Japan, unbelievable isn't it? A Japanese performance car made over here and shipped back to Japan, whatever next?
I have lately been trying to find out about the Alfa 156 GTA that goes on sale next year. It sounds like it will be a great car. A lovely 3.2 litre V6 producing 250bhp on a revised 156 with wider track, suspension, body etc. FWD is the only drawback which will make putting the power down interesting (talks of LSD as standard :) or possible mega traction control :(). The price is also a bit off putting £27k-£28k, about £3k too much for my liking.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Just talked my sister into buying one, looks quite mean in the flesh especialy in black,torque i think is only about 140lbs/ft but 0-60 in 6.7 not bad considering it will only do 56mph in 2nd and needs an extra gearchange to get past 60 and is quiker to 100 than the new impreza.Bang for buck theres nothing to touch it.Should arrive first week in Nov will let you know what it goes like(well somebodys got to teach her how to drive the bloody thing).
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I agree about the Integra and as I have said before if they were selling it over here officially then no contest, I would get one, but as they aren't then if you want one then you are stuck with a grey import (currently only 3 in the country!). If it goes wrong ouch! a long wait at the very least for parts.
The Civic shares the same gearbox and a slightly detuned engine and its £8k cheaper!
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yeah, new Integra is the danglies but is it going to be sold here officially?

Style-wise Honda have been going backwards with the Civic for 2 generations now, I can't believe how dumpy the new one looks. No matter how many scantily-clad birds or VTEC-derived hp they tempt us with I'd never want one. Evos, Stis etc. may not be considered 'pretty' in the conventional way but no-one could say they lack presence and desirability

Where are the Peugeot rally cash-ins? Thats what I want to know. 180/200hp 206/307 at the same price as the Type-R would rock the house - I've always rated Peugeot's FWD handling but they never seem to get the product out at the right price.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Peugeot will issue a hot 206 with 180hp and FWD. I can't understand why they don't cash in on their rally success with a 4WD, turbo car. With around 250hp and only 1150kg, this would be something nice for narrow tarmac roads!

Mike
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Well yes, thats the obvious route to take but no-one except the Japs seems to have the balls to make affordable 4WD turbonutter jobs these days (Audis don't count for various reasons, not least cost).

Even Ford are poofing out of taking on Subaru and amp; Mits in the showrooms, why no Focus Cosworth/Racing/whatever after all this time?

Like I've said before, name me one turbo 4WD, rally-inspired car that hasn't gone on to seriously enhance the maker's rep and become a classic. I just don't understand why more manufacturers pick up the gauntlet, esp. after investing so much in a WRC programme!
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Had the misfortune to have a basic new civic as a loan car whilst 6 was being worked on. My children hid in the backseats for fear of being recognised in it (and they are only 5|PLS|3). It is one bizarre car inside, the dashboard to base of windscreen must measure about 3 foot and the gearlever is a dashboard mounted jobby. It was truly the most orrible car I have driven and that's saying a lot given the stuff I've endured (Lancia Dedra included!!). Integra is a different matter.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
The looks aren't everyone's cup of tea but I like 'em (especially in black, and those alloys... dribble) and amp; if you need practicality this is a great all rounder. Have some doubts about the need to rev the tits off it to make it go and also have heard it suffers from lack of steering feel but I'm taking a test drive anyway just for the hell of it. There hasn't been a really good hot hatch in years. Now if could shoe horn one of those VTEC's into a 205 - nice.

Steve.
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
What about the Ford Focus RS ? It must be to quote hornier and more the danglies than the CivicTypeR and the Integra Type R ? :)

btw, is there going to be a 4wd Ford Focus turbo car like the WRC Focus ?

- ronnie
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Focus RS is all well and good but can you buy one today? No, although Ford have been mouthing off about various hot Focuses (Focii?) since the launch of the Focus a few years back.

Even when they are available you won't get much change from 20k, if any.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see a proper hot Ford again (ST200 doesn't quite cut the mustard, does it?) but the constant dithering makes 'ole Henry look a bit confused.
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
The reviews of the Focus RS look good. It has a trick Quaife diff that gives it 4WD like traction in the dry - good lap times, and strong brakes.

There won't be a 4WD Focus till the next generation - they can't get the mechanicals to work. The WRC car is completely different.

Shame - thought the Focus rally car has always looked extremely adjustable.

It is odd that Ford don't cash in - I know the RS Turbo and Cosworth are old hats, but Ford did own this market space. In fact the fore runners, Lancia, Audi and Ford - where are any of them now??? Lancia - gone completely. Audi, produces #### like the S3 (mind the RS4 isn't too bad I suppose), and Ford haven't produced a proper quick car for ages.

Seems to me that Subaru and Mitsubishi have it sewn up - except, Mitsubishi have never really taken it that seriously. I mean, there still isn't an officially imported 7 as far as I know, and they have always been slow on the uptake (no official 4 or 5). I can't believe they really thought that Tommi's victories would help them sell more Galants and Lancer estates!!!
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
My local opposite me Honda dealer get their Civic R on the 28th oct ,they have sold 7 and have 86 test drives awaiting.
Built in Swindon [not a bonus]
Siver 6 you have to change gear to 3rd in an Evo to make 60 mph unless you have the short gearing .I checked my manuals and I was disappointed Rs different but I feel not many EVo's will do 60 mph in second with out hitting severelly the red line.not nice.
0-60 apparently is 6.5 swith the civic R this worries me because they quote figures of 4.5s for the E6 and no one has really achieved it apart from the factoty guys .0-60 is a ****** figure and really shouldnt be even looked at.Brochures can't quote o-100 as its beyond UK speed limitations .
I like front wheel drive as opposed to RWD because its fed through the steering .I drive my Evo through the front end as I know that the rear will now follow .
As far as the focus is concerned .Its got to be a mighty cosworth make over for it to gain any ground with me .
I have always and will give notice to an Escort cossie in dark blue or black ,the focus unless 4X4 will never come close .too much power to too fewer wheels.
But I am thinking of off the lights and track days just like I do with the Evo .
I have come to the conclusion that nothing so far has beaten me in my E4 in every day usage .Perhaps I can drop a few Hp and the odd second off 0-100 .
and don;t any one say buy a Scoob !
I am now trying wet weather driving to my max and its getting a little scary.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I think the reason why Ford and others dont make 4wd rockets anymore is that they don't need to anymore to go rallying.It is well known that in the past these homologation specials (integrale,cossie,quattro) were built at a great loss to the manufactures,and lets face it while most people love evo's and imprezza's the majority are not willing to buy one due to the cost of ownership and image.Mitsubishi still make the evo for homoligation for group a|PLS|n and as an image builder for the brand(lets face it what else have they got?) but would be very suprised if they have made a profit from any of the evolutions 1 through to 7.
 
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Sure the new Civic R is a nice little screemer but it looks way to MPV like to have great success. We should begin seeing UPS or FedEx Civic Rs running round....iVetc delivery vans....then we will get out moneys worth from postal deliveries!
The Integra R looks much better but it has serious problems with its steering....there is just no feedback!!
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Chunky,

I watch the rallying when I can ,but I bought my Evo purely for many other reasons ,but I do find that those in the ford Foc'i seem to think that the Evo is a bolt on spoiler job and don't realise that it will P!ss all over them same with the peugot when will they ever learn.
never have liked fords except the Escort cossie.and the 1600 E cortina:)
They are quoting 200 horses for the RS ,but have seen no paper figures.
As motoring is getting obsessed with figures .read a previous issue of autocar and the review of the 375BHp MG estate to rival the Audi RS4 ,loads of torque.
silver 7 ,I agree lost leader brand imagery,how ever look at all the great cars we are actually missing out on .
Pjero evo,eclipse turbo,GTO [GT3000] never see them in showrooms any more Fto,past skylines ,pulsar gti-r,supra turbo,starlet turbo,these have never really been in the portfolio of the manufacturers and there must be others .
we have to make do with a pile of shite from these manufacturers and make way for our hot hatch golf gti ,what a performance waste of time that is .I can see why many went to the Scoob impreza .
Okitenik,
Perhaps in the future mpvs will have a second storey like a double decker bus,nice 150 mph delivey van:D
My curiosity is getting the better of me as car prices have fallen some what ,but still not enough,.
The civic R for the price and its target audience seems pretty good value !
I may test drive one when its in .
But I will have to get to Ralliart and have a look at the black E5 they have .
 
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