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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have just been reading in Autocar about the official E7's and in particular, the 300 bhp version. CCC claim that it will do 0-60 in 4.0secs. The question I have is how. These cars are based on RS2's so will weigh nearly the same as a GSR. The best tests of high powered E7's have been in Autocar where they tested the Warrender (RC) 340 at 4.4 seconds while the Extreme was timed at 4.2 secs. Both these cars have at least 15% more power or a minimum of 340 bhp. Is this another case of CCC misleading their customers (don't mention the warranty issues!) or have I missed something.
 
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I would be impressed if an E7 with 300bhp could do 0-60 in 4.0s dead, we need a full spec of the E7 to see what's going on.

sounds doubtful to me to be honest

R
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Autocar is talkin out it's shita again, CCC claim 0-62 will B 5.2 Secs, how slow is dat ?
CCC's claim of 300bhp is just down to filter and amp; exhaust.
With a price tag of way over 31K it would be better and amp; cheapa 2 get a 7 and amp; do da mods URself
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
the 300 bhp version. CCC claim that it will do 0-60 in 4.0secs. The question I have is how

Not strictly possible IMHO.

Autocar's always been the first to predict/believe ludicrously optimistic 0-60 times for various jap. turbos and has probably based these on the 0-60 in 4.4s it achieved in its standard E6 GSR. In fact, that GSR wasn't standard, so either Autocar were in on the deception or the road testers were just painfully naive and didn't notice the non-standard exhaust. Doesn't matter which ;)

To get a 1440kg car (inc. driver) from 0-60 in 4 secs requires a sustained output of around 175bhp at the wheels. That's an average 175bhp over the whole run before you've even deducted time lost due to traction problems, a gearchange or considered that the car is only getting its full max. power at the wheels momentarily. Very, very, very unlikely IMHO. I'd go so far as to say impossible but I never like to say that ;)

Ian.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Yellow5,

(I can't see your post on here but I got an e-mail with it so I'm assuming you did post it ... :) )

The claim was concerning a car which is supposed to have around 300bhp. Less than 400bhp could also include 301bhp - 399bhp.

Can you be more specific about how much power the sub-4.0secs cars were supposed to have and what type they were? Clutch/suspension modifications?

Ian.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Original Post:

In fact, that GSR wasn't standard, so either Autocar were in on the deception or the road testers were just painfully naive and didn't notice the non-standard exhaust. Doesn't matter which ;)

Ian.
Ian - did you actually see the article in question? They did mention that it had the HKS exhaust, so there was no naivety or attempted deception. If a different ECU was fitted and the boost raised by Co-ord how were Autocar supposed to know?
I find Autocar to be an excellent magazine, so I get a bit fed up when people criticise it without making sure of their facts ;)

Daryl
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Homerdog,

Yes, I did read it when it first came out. Obviously my age is catching up on my memory and I forgot the bit about the exhaust.

Plenty of other pointers that it might be modified though (the 0-100 time alone) so maybe I was being overly harsh but not completely unjustified.

I used to enjoy reading Autocar but have gone off it recently.

Ian.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Original Post:
Droid
Nothing to do with them preferring the Evo VII to the M3 is it? ;) :D
I seem to remember them voting the M3 as best new car of 2001 with the Evo 7 several places behind (or was it the Evo 6)?

Or are you talking about the best driver's car test (I agree with that result)?

Autocar actually quite likes the M3 but that alone wouldn't make me read it.

Good theory though :D

Ian.
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
To get a 300 or 320 bhp Evo from 0-60 in 4 seconds, all you need is a bgi clutch.

I forgot who, with an exhaust air filter and Motec in Sweden (350 bhp) measured his car from 0-62 in 3.88s
Maybe Prospeed can confirm this.
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Claudius

I could believe that time in a lightweight RS but not in a GSR or RS2 loaded with comfort features!
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Just for reference guys, I did a shootout with Redline mag. At the time my VI was 318bhp, on pro timing gear my 0-60 was 4.4secs, couldn't get it lower than that. 1/4 mile was 12.7 @111

To put this into perspective a M.A.D. Escort cossie with 400bhp did 3.23 0-60, 11.9 1/4

Not saying they didn't do it, may be poss with a s**t hot driver :)

Kevin
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Original Post:
Claudius

I could believe that time in a lightweight RS but not in a GSR or RS2 loaded with comfort features!
Simon

GSR and RS2 are very different cars, steering, AYC, climate control are absent from the RS2. The car I am talking about was an RS2 or TME because it was in Sweden, ie LHD (GSR does not exist LHD on an Evo 6).
Anyway I can only say what I've been told, I wasnt there so I cannot confirm.
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Claudius

My understanding is that the E7's being brought in by CCC are being called RS2's but they have aircon, ayc, abs and probably verything you hate in an Evo :D.
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
To get a 300 or 320 bhp Evo from 0-60 in 4 seconds, all you need is a bgi clutch.

Can you back that up Claudius? Sounds like fantasy to me but, as ever, I'm prepared to be surprised, once you produce some real numbers and references ;)

A 350bhp car doing 3.88s doesn't even begin to hint that a car with 14% less power can manage a 0-60 time that's only 3% slower (even with the world's best clutch, which the CCC E7 300 certainly won't have).

Ian.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
... oh, and that's for a 1440kg car (including 70kgs' worth of driver and equipment), which is probably less than what the car in question weighs anyway.

Ian.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
IAn,

I have no idea what you are talking about; I said that someone in Sweden with an Evo with a Motec and 350 bhp and uprated clutch measured 3.88 or sthg like that, under 4.0 s from 0-62. I think Prospeed told me this. I could not work this out mathematically for you with air flow ratios, turbo spool up times and EGT, sorry mate ;)
I guess the main point here is that a strong clutch will allow you to get the power to the ground without slipping for a good launch. Everything is in the launch for a good 0-60.

Surely not as fast as your M3, how could it be, it's so much cheaper! :D
 
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Claudius,

Sorry ... I'll make myself clearer.

You said To get a 300 or 320 bhp Evo from 0-60 in 4 seconds, all you need is a bgi clutch.

I said (or meant to say) Can you prove that with a real example of a car actually doing that? I wasn't asking you to do any maths or physics because I know you can't ... no offense intended. All you need to do is come up with an example :D

The 350bhp car doing 3.88sec is completely irrelevant (for the reasons I gave).

Everything is in the launch for a good 0-60.

So the perfect launch would lead to, say, sub 2.0 sec 0-60? No. With 0-60 in the region of 4.0secs, a perfect launch will contribute greatly BUT you still need lots of power to physically accelerate the car so quickly (that's exactly what power is ... the rate at which you can give something kinetic energy). As I said before, you need a sustained 175bhp at the wheels which, from a car with a peak of around 220bhp at the wheels is, frankly, unbelievable.

Ian.
 
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