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K1 rods

10K views 68 replies 20 participants last post by  KenX 
#1 ·
Can anyone say what bhp these rod are able to take.I want to build a long rod 2.0 ltr as on a buget for a Hks turbo if goordsport can get me one from japan with cams for FQ300 evo8.Also pistons that dont have piston slap on cold starts ta.:smthumbup
 
#13 ·
Where do you get the information from as to what a rod is rated to? Looking on the websites they dont actually say. I would have thought a rod would be rated to a maximum rpm and torque as apposed to BHP? I could make bhp via a 10k rpm low torque motor or high torque 6000 rpm motor - two entirely different scenarios - same bhp.
 
#4 ·
With any aftermarket forged piston there is likely to be a little noise when the engine is cold due to the increased tolerances required. This can be minimised by making sure you get the machining doing correctly.
As for rods, I would pay the little extra and opt for something not forged in China.
 
#9 ·
And there is nothing wrong with Wiseco pistons either.

Engine builders and tuners have there prefered brands and use what they like. This does not mean the other brands are no good.

Wiseco, JE, Cosworth, CP, Omega will all work as long as they are installed correctly.
I always use Wiseco 1400HD in my builds and was never let down.
If you machine the block to the correct clearance stipulated by Wiseco, the slap is inexistant when the engine is cold.
Only thing I can fault is the last set I bought I had a wrong compression ring packed. The supplier sent it out the next day.;)
 
#14 · (Edited)
You are right to point out that torque and RPM figures are important factors when selecting conrods .... as are stroke and piston weight.

I'm not quoting any information from K1 as I can't see any (perhaps for good reason). I would imagine it is very difficult for manufactures to give ratings as there are so many factors that contribute to strength of a conrod - suitability will differ per application.

If you look on Manleys website for example. They quote a horsepower range.
http://www.manleyperformance.com/dl/2011/rods.pdf
The don't say if this is ATF or ATW so interpret it as you will.
Would I run 600bhp on H beam manleys.... .....erm no. I've seen quite a few break running way under 600bhp atf.

Are the K1's better than the Manley H beams.... not sure. If you look around the forums you will see that most tuners will not recommend running more tham 550bhp on these chinese H beam rods. They are a common rod for "rod job"s where people run up to this figure. Most tuners will recommend an upgrade to a stronger rod (and piston) if the customer intends to run in excess of 550bhp.

The K1's may be fine up to 600+ but it's a gamble - some will be strong enough some won't. Quality control on these budget rods is pretty pants - thus quality and strength will vary.

IMO it's always better to overspec an engine build - rods and their bolts especially! People should buy the best they can afford as you get what you pay for. The best thing for the customer to do is for them to talk to their tuner. That way budget and targets can be discusses and the tuner can select the best parts for the job within the customers budget.
 
#15 ·
I've asked Tom at K1 about BHP rating the rods and for that matter when he worked for Oliver, and he says there are too many factors to simply quote a bhp figure. We just want a bhp figure as its what we understand.

All I can tell you again is that I've sold over 200 sets of K1's last year for Evo, Impreza etc and not had a problem.
 
#16 · (Edited)
I must admit Gav I've never seen or heard a about a K1 H-beam breaking. Or BC H-Beams for that matter.

I've seen quite a few Manley and Eagle H-beam failures posted up on the forums though.

I've heard some say that a lot of these H-beam rods are generic and come out of the same factories with different branding - do you know if there is any truth in this? If yes - what rods are the same?
 
#17 ·
I've heard this too, and whilst I don't doubt there are a limited number of factories, if you look at the rods closely you can see detail differences between them. Eagles are a bit rough around the edges, Scat are tidy along with the Manleys. I was surprised to see the Manleys breaking tbh. And the BC rods I have seen also look well finished.

What I like about the K1's is that they have a uniform quality and appearance and the bolts are their own spec with an asymetric thread for better torquing.

And I'll have a new range of H beams and I beams shorlty to go with K1 and Oliver for even more chioce and confusion!
 
#21 ·
It's not the same industry I'm in granted (pertochemical) but off-spec Chinese steel is a real problem, to the point we are not allowed to procure equipment from there. I understand there is a market for cheaper rods, but in real money terms what is the difference in price between these items?
 
#22 ·
Understood.

But there have been Chinese rods around for a long while now in the USA with the Chevy big blocks and the Hemis etc before we get to the Evo's and the Imprezas so if there was a fundamental issue it would have come to light by now.

I've said it before, the only way we'll ever get to know which are the best rods is to analyse them all.
 
#24 ·
My view on this, is that I have seen manley h-beams snap or bent, I have seen eagle h-beams do that as well over my years in tuning, I have never seen K1 ones though, but I do know a bit about metallurgy, alloys and metalworking processes, and I have taken 3 different types of H-beams chinese rods to a metallurgist in Athens back in 2004 to compare them with a reputable brand of rods that is widely used. He concluded after examining and testing the rods, that they were aproximately 50% weaker in every aspect compared to the reputable H-beam rod. Their metal fatique and creep rate was double.


If a piston goes there is good chance depending on the damage to salvage more than 80% of your engine, if a rod goes your engine is completely destroyed.


Marios
 
#25 ·
My view on this, is that I have seen manley h-beams snap or bent, I have seen eagle h-beams do that as well over my years in tuning, I have never seen K1 ones though, but I do know a bit about metallurgy, alloys and metalworking processes, and I have taken 3 different types of H-beams chinese rods to a metallurgist in Athens back in 2004 to compare them with a reputable brand of rods that is widely used. He concluded after examining and testing the rods, that they were aproximately 50% weaker in every aspect compared to the reputable H-beam rod. Their metal fatique and creep rate was double.

If a piston goes there is good chance depending on the damage to salvage more than 80% of your engine, if a rod goes your engine is completely destroyed.

Marios
Ive just had H-beams fitted to my car. It will never see more than 500/450 in its current format, but with all this talk of H-beam failure Im a little concerned.

Marios, I see your findings were back in 2004.......is it possible that quality from the chinese factories has markedly reduced since then?
 
#40 ·
Do not go beyond 620 bhp on K1 rods, the bhp number is for reference as far as the bhp factor is concerned, many variables can damage a rod. I would not run more than 560-570 bhp max on a daily basis either on the K1.

Marios
 
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