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Old 09-01-2017, 11:52   #1
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Everyone knows everything about spark plugs right?

Read on
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Old 09-01-2017, 12:04   #2
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So, why do GrpN/R4 rally cars tend to use NTK Racing plugs? They cost circa 25GPB ea plus tax!
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Old 09-01-2017, 12:34   #3
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Enjoyable read that James - thanks for posting.
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Old 09-01-2017, 19:33   #4
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I've now fallen foul (no pun intended) twice of spark plugs which have been blown out of cylinder heads resulting in stripped threads in the head.

The first time was on my old m3. It happened on a track day a couple of weeks after I'd bought it. I never touched or checked the plugs and I suspect the previous owner had replaced them before I bought it and under tightened them.

More recently and to my disbelief this happened again on my civic. Once again I'd never touched the plugs since owning the car, though I believe it may be due to the extreme vibration caused by my almost solid engine mounts which I think might have caused them to gradually unwind over time. So I have to accept some responsibility there for not checking them (I guess I never thought it would happen to me again!)

Anyway, the point of this post is just to share some pain and encourage anyone reading to check your plugs, cause it really leaves you up **** creek if this happens!!

Last edited by big_joe; 09-01-2017 at 19:35..
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Old 09-01-2017, 20:04   #5
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Great read, thanks!
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Old 09-01-2017, 20:37   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grants View Post
So, why do GrpN/R4 rally cars tend to use NTK Racing plugs? They cost circa 25GPB ea plus tax!
Hi,
I always love reading your cryptic posts and unsure if you are trolling, have a question or making a statement.
But i'll do my best to respond as my post is all about sharing information and just making people aware of some information that is already out there by the biggest manufacturer of spark plugs in the world, NGK.

Now the NTK that i think you are referring to is NTK Oxygen Sensors & is a division of NGK.
NTK is the world’s largest manufacturer of oxygen sensors. NTK Oxygen Sensors are designed to maintain optimal fuel efficiency and are supplied with a direct-fit connector similar to those used by the OEM manufacturer for easy installation.

NGK Racing spark plugs on the other hand are NGK's premium line of racing spark plugs & have a similar price to what you refer.
Built to withstand the severe conditions that occur in racing engines, NGK Racing Spark Plugs feature electrode materials and configurations as follows:

Electrode materials - Many use precious metals such as platinum or gold/palladium for greater durability and lower voltage requirements.
Electrode configurations - Fine-wire center electrodes provide better sparking and enhanced ignitability. Fine-wire ground electrodes further improve the ignitability of the plug.
Insulator configurations - Special configurations are used for the insulator noses to improve throttle response.

I hope this helps.
Best regards,
James
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Old 09-01-2017, 21:52   #7
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Hi Grants,

NGK's own website mentions the use of racing plugs where the application is needed. Please use this link to discover more - https://www.ngk.de/en/products-techn...g-spark-plugs/

The post James has made was aimed towards the majority of applications on this forum and made no mention of the word "race" or "racing".

Regards,
David
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Old 09-01-2017, 22:15   #8
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great read there guys. thanks for that. has been helpful with my current woes.

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Old 09-01-2017, 22:25   #9
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Neither of you seem to understand that GrpN/R4 Evos do not have "race" engines.

They are absolutely standard engines/turbos, allbeit blueprinted, and at best using FIA 102 Ron fuel their power is limited to 270/330bhp +/- 10% (turbo restrictor)

Would care to answer my original question



Ps NGK/NTK mixup
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Old 09-01-2017, 22:27   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danb87 View Post
great read there guys. thanks for that. has been helpful with my current woes.

dan
Excellent thanks for the feedback Dan.
We couldn't hope for more. If the info we post helps just 1 person in the Evo community then it's a step in the right direction

I dont want to put you on the spot but if you have the time and want to share how this helped, i'm sure others would like to hear.
Maybe a quick format like;
Symptoms...
Problem...
Solution...
Parts used...

I'll put this post in our vendors section here also so people can use it as a go to if they're experiencing similar.

Thanks again
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Old 09-01-2017, 22:47   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grants View Post
So, why do GrpN/R4 rally cars tend to use NTK Racing plugs? They cost circa 25GPB ea plus tax!
Quote:
Originally Posted by grants View Post
Neither of you seem to understand that GrpN/R4 Evos do not have "race" engines.

They are absolutely standard engines/turbos, allbeit blueprinted, and at best using FIA 102 Ron fuel their power is limited to 270/330bhp +/- 10% (turbo restrictor)

Would care to answer my original question



Ps NGK/NTK mixup
Hi,
Yes you are correct, we may not understand exactly to what you are referring, as we are not experts in GrpN/R4 Evos.
However, we are specialists in Evo ignitions (and many others) and an ignition is only as good as the spark plug it's firing. The information i posted was general information to give all Evo owners some information to read and in hope of helping those who may need it as most people can or want to change their own spark plugs.

I appreciate that you may have knowledge of GrpN/R4 Evos and to what spark plugs they use and that is great & appreciate you sharing some information.

To answer your question further and to back up my recent editorial in Evolution magazine, the correct spark plug for any application is always dictated by the tuner/mapper. The same goes for the spark plug gap as this needs to be set to the state of tune in the engine when it is being mapped.
No one has a better opinion on the correct spark plug/gap than your tuner/mapper.

I hope this helps answer the question.

Best regards,
James
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Last edited by [email protected] Performance; 10-01-2017 at 01:52..
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Old 09-01-2017, 23:02   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grants View Post
Neither of you seem to understand that GrpN/R4 Evos do not have "race" engines.

They are absolutely standard engines/turbos, allbeit blueprinted, and at best using FIA 102 Ron fuel their power is limited to 270/330bhp +/- 10% (turbo restrictor)

Would care to answer my original question



Ps NGK/NTK mixup
Grants, we do know what Group N cars are thank you but they are not our main customer base since we do not deal with rally cars. I've also never removed spark plugs from a Group N car to see if they are anything other than the model you mention. The fact they use an anti-lag system is hard on engine ignition components hence that would be their reasoning for using a race spark plug. There are higher temperatures and pressures developed with this system so even though they are not 700hp it appears their engineers have chose to use a race plug to suit that need.


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