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-   -   Oil Temps on Track c130'C (https://www.lancerregister.com//showthread.php?t=380951)

MAD7BOY 18-07-2011 21:07

Oil Temps on Track c130'C
 
Went to Bedford with Dad on Friday for an evening session. Oil temp was hitting 125-130'C after a few laps (brakes etc still fine as I have big ones) but at that temp I thought I should probably have a cool down lap and come in because I think that's getting towards the limit of what the oil can take.

Those temps are measured at the oil filter using the OEM sensor point.
For reference it's normally 90-100'C when cruising the Mway (stabilises), then up to 115'C on a 'spirited' road drive (again, tends to stabilise), but up to 125-130'C on track after a bit (still looked to be climbing, so came in before I saw it stabilise.)

Car is an 8 FQ300 running stage 1 mods @1.7Bar(ish). It also has an aftermarket front bumper which I think is probably restricting airflow to the cooler. We made up a 'scoop' to sit behind the new bumper as the OEM scoop/guide had to be removed when fitting the bumper.

So, couple of questions then:
1. How hot can I safely get Silkolene Titan S 5w40 before I need to let it cool down?
2. What options do I have to deal with this? (Thicker oil probably not a good idea? New cooling guides (e.g. the HEL ones?) New oil cooler?) PS - I don't want to change the bumper, so lets work with that as a constraint!
3. If the conclusion is for a new oil cooler i) which one do people reccomend? ii) new or used? iii) something I can fit myself?

Cheers in advance for any assistance. :)

Phil2333 18-07-2011 21:14

I did see 120+ on track with 1.8 bar 390bhp on a standard cooler. (silkolene pro s)

Wasnt happy with hitting them temps so fitted a new mocal 19 row cooler and the max i get is about 110.:)...after say 6 laps

Never seen 115 on the road:eek:....but my sensor is in the filter plate.

Around 85-90 on the road.

super rover 18-07-2011 21:17

daft as it seem what about getting air OUT from the back of the oil cooler ,isnt there the washer bottle behind the oil cooler then the arch liner
may be venting the bumper like a TME or 6 GSR ,is something to look at

its all well and good getting cold air in but if its goes no where and the airflow stalls its wasted

MAD7BOY 18-07-2011 21:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by phil lloyd (Post 4045336)
I did see 120+ on track with 1.8 bar 390bhp on a standard cooler. (silkolene pro s)

Wasnt happy with hitting them temps so fitted a new mocal 19 row cooler and the max i get is about 110.:)...after say 6 laps

Never seen 115 on the road:eek:....but my sensor is in the filter plate.

Around 85-90 on the road.

How much was the mocal and did you fit it yourself?

Sorry, I got my description wrong, it is indeed measured at the filter, not the pump.

And yeah, when I was hitting 115'C on the road it was pretty intense driving on some very quiet roads I know very well.

MAD7BOY 18-07-2011 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by super rover (Post 4045343)
daft as it seem what about getting air OUT from the back of the oil cooler ,isnt there the washer bottle behind the oil cooler then the arch liner
may be venting the bumper like a TME or 6 GSR ,is something to look at

its all well and good getting cold air in but if its goes no where and the airflow stalls its wasted

It's been a while since I last had the bumper/arch liner off and I don't think there's a bottle behind it. (Screenwash is in the o/s rear boot and ICS is n/s front of engine.) But you've got a good point, the area of the arch liner behind the oil cooler is louvered plastic, but it may well benefit from reaming out the holes a bit. Great idea.

Phil2333 18-07-2011 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAD7BOY (Post 4045350)
How much was the mocal and did you fit it yourself?

Sorry, I got my description wrong, it is indeed measured at the filter, not the pump.

And yeah, when I was hitting 115'C on the road it was pretty intense driving on some very quiet roads I know very well.

Mocal was from demon tweeks...with the lines/connections etc...was about 200 quid ish.

Fitted it myself,bit fiddly.

There is space on the evo 6 for a 24 row,wish id of got one of them.

Mocal or HEL.:thumbup::coolsm:

As said tho,it might not just be the cooler.

phil-sparky 18-07-2011 21:27

what gauge are you using? i used to have a r spec oil gauge and that read a fair bit higer than my spa digital gauge i'm now using, you could maybe actually only getting 100c on track if your gauge isnt calibrated/accurate

thetyrant 18-07-2011 21:31

What are gauge are you using ?....ive seen very different temps with different brands of gauge even with sensors mounted in same place etc.

Difficult to know which was most accurate but as my ebay gauges read high and sometimes inconsitent ( gave me a fright going around brussels ring road on spa trip to see oil temp shoot up to 110c when normally about 85c!) i didnt trust them after that so got rid and took the plunge and bought a spa temp and pressure gauge which was always consistent and was more inclined to beleive it.

Bigger cooler will help as above :D

CHeers
Ian

super rover 18-07-2011 21:37

yeah a bigger cooler could help but if the gauge isnt showing the right temps in the first place it could make it worth less buying one ,id have said a spirited run around an curcuit should see the temps kept in cheak by the standard cooler

Phil2333 18-07-2011 21:38

Yep..twin s.p.a:coolsm::thumbup:

MAD7BOY 18-07-2011 21:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by phil-sparky (Post 4045372)
what gauge are you using? i used to have a r spec oil gauge and that read a fair bit higer than my spa digital gauge i'm now using, you could maybe actually only getting 100c on track if your gauge isnt calibrated/accurate

Quote:

Originally Posted by thetyrant (Post 4045382)
What are gauge are you using ?....ive seen very different temps with different brands of gauge even with sensors mounted in same place etc.

Difficult to know which was most accurate but as my ebay gauges read high and sometimes inconsitent ( gave me a fright going around brussels ring road on spa trip to see oil temp shoot up to 110c when normally about 85c!) i didnt trust them after that so got rid and took the plunge and bought a spa temp and pressure gauge which was always consistent and was more inclined to beleive it.

Bigger cooler will help as above :D

CHeers
Ian

Great minds, eh chaps?

The gauge I'm using is made by a company called 'Trailtech' and the model is 'Vapor'. It was sold as a digital dashboard for off road bikes/buggies, but it has some cool features which are handy in the car: Digital speedo, air temp, oil temp, 2 stage oil temp warning, rev counter, dual stage shift lights, and peak/hold function on speed/revs/temp.

I havn't managed to get the rev counter features to work, as I can't get a reliable rpm pickup, but the oil temp and speedo work just fine.
http://www.cyclebuy.com/shopping/tra...vapor-tach.jpg

I researched it online and then I bought it from a dirt bike shop. When I tested the sensor prior to installation (a couple of years ago now) the readings it gave in just boiled water seemed reasonable from what I recall.

Basically it's no 'ebay special', but of course I can't guarantee hot accurate it is either, because I've not had it out to test it recently.

I do have an IR thermometer gun now, so I guess I could go for a drive and then take the temp of the cooler, but not sure that would tell me much useful.

phil-sparky 18-07-2011 21:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAD7BOY (Post 4045404)
Great minds, eh chaps?

The gauge I'm using is made by a company called 'Trailtech' and the model is 'Vapor'. It was sold as a digital dashboard for off road bikes/buggies, but it has some cool features which are handy in the car: Digital speedo, air temp, oil temp, 2 stage oil temp warning, rev counter, dual stage shift lights, and peak/hold function on speed/revs/temp.

I havn't managed to get the rev counter features to work, as I can't get a reliable rpm pickup, but the oil temp and speedo work just fine.
http://www.cyclebuy.com/shopping/tra...vapor-tach.jpg

I researched it online and then I bought it from a dirt bike shop. When I tested the sensor prior to installation (a couple of years ago now) the readings it gave in just boiled water seemed reasonable from what I recall.

Basically it's no 'ebay special', but of course I can't guarantee hot accurate it is either, because I've not had it out to test it recently.

I do have an IR thermometer gun now, so I guess I could go for a drive and then take the temp of the cooler, but not sure that would tell me much useful.

should be pretty good then, have the temps rose over the years its been fitted or have they always reached 115 on a spirited drive, you could maybe try the heat gun on the oil filter house or on the sump to see if it gives a close reading think the cooler will be colder due to the air going through/ around it

pan1 19-07-2011 01:02

10/60 oil may help castrol edge i always found anything less for track work gets too hot too quick s..t a brick when using the same oil as you on track... although on cold days car needs a little longer to warm up with 10/60 !

MAD7BOY 19-07-2011 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by phil-sparky (Post 4045409)
should be pretty good then, have the temps rose over the years its been fitted or have they always reached 115 on a spirited drive, you could maybe try the heat gun on the oil filter house or on the sump to see if it gives a close reading think the cooler will be colder due to the air going through/ around it

The cruising temp has always been 90-100'C as measured by this, so I'm inclinded to believe the temps I'm seeing on track, which I think are also logically consistent with the restrictive front bumper and driving the car hard.

So if we proceed on the basis that I really think the temps are getting as high as the gauge indicates... what can I do about it?

So far we've come up with reaming out the holes in the arch liner behind the oil cooler. Anything else?

MAD7BOY 19-07-2011 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by pan1 (Post 4045547)
10/60 oil may help castrol edge i always found anything less for track work gets too hot too quick s..t a brick when using the same oil as you on track... although on cold days car needs a little longer to warm up with 10/60 !

I didn't want to go for thicker oil as it seems like it will be too thick when the car's not on track, which causes it's own problems.

I guess I could take some 10w60 and 5w40 to the track and change the oil at the start of the day to 10w60, then change back to 5w40 at the end of the day.

Not sure if I would fancy 'keeping' the old oil and swapping it back in/out, but using fresh each time would get expensive quickly, so getting a cooler looks like a more reasonable idea?


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