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New Evo IX Owner - Compression Test Results Not Good!!!

24K views 78 replies 24 participants last post by  Dan-B 
#1 ·
Hello all,

I've recently purchased a new Evo IX MR FQ-360 which I'm super happy with but having just taking it to 'Auto Torque' up in Oxford, they've carried out an exhaustive health check, of which a compression test is included. The results are as follows:

Piston 1: 10.5 Bar / 152 PSi
Piston 2: 10.5 Bar / 152 PSi
Piston 3: 8.5 Bar / 123 PSi
Piston 4: 10.5 Bar / 152 PSi

They have confirmed that by using a Bore Camera, they can see some scoring on the inside of the Bore Housing on Piston 3 which has an alarmingly low pressure.

The car has done 22k miles, they have also confirmed that the rest of the car is in very good condition but it's likely it's been pushed hard in it's short life.

It's worth noting that the car has been re-mapped with 3 maps:

1.2 Bar - Low Boost
1.5 Bar - Medium Boost
1.7 Bar - High Boost

I believe the re-mapping was done at around 10k miles.

I was wondering what anyone else's experience is with Evo IX's and their engines running low compression?

From research and speaking with Auto Torque, they suggested the compression should be reading around 12.5 Bar / 181 PSI.

Any feedback or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks all!
 
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#4 ·
Forget compression test as it doesn't tell you where the air is going. Get a leak down test done as this is the way you correctly diagnose if there is a fault.

Mark
Thank you for your response, I will call AT tomorrow and ask them to carry out that test, I did also read what you've suggested.

What are your thoughts on the initial readings though?

Thanks.
 
#10 ·
Hi mate not far from me and not far from myself and gavalar on hear we both have the same model as yourself sorry to hear about your dilemma listen what mark has to say mans a genius when it comes down to mechanics 👍
Thank you very much buddy, I have requested AT to carry out the Leak Down Test, they are just doing a bit of other work. Once that's done, I will await the results and see what they have to say.

They're going to talk about what my options are moving forwards! (Anxious) :eek:

If you guys are near by, should meet at some point, would be good to get together with some other Evo owners! Once the car is done anyway!

Thanks again.
 
#8 ·
Was the compression test performed with a cold or warm/hot engine. If all the pressures had been around 150psi I would personally have been quite happy.

But as already very sensibly suggested, get a leakdown test done. Incidentally, I'm very surprised that Auto Torque haven't already suggested it to you because until you pinpoint the cause of the loss of compression (piston rings, inlet or exhaust valves etc) you really don't know what to start pulling apart.
 
#12 ·
Hi Phil,

Thank you for your input, yes after you mentioned it, I did ask myself the same question. I ran it past them but wanting to concentrate on the initial work that it was originally booked in for, they said we would re-visit this area after.

We have agreed that a Leak Down Test will now be carried out and await the result, likely tomorrow this will happen so I'll update the thread then.

Thanks again :smthumbup
 
#18 · (Edited)
Hope it isn’t anything serious and gets resolved quickly and cheaply. Don’t let this dishearten your enjoyment (not implying it is) of what is a cracking car. I’ve had my IX MR for over seven years now and absolutely love it.
Get some pics of the Evo uploaded on here.
 
#19 ·
Hope it isn't anything serious and gets resolved quickly and cheaply. Don't let this dishearten your enjoyment (not implying it is) of what is a cracking car. I've had my IX MR for over seven years now and absolutely love it.
Get some pics of the Evo uploaded on here.
Thanks for the kind words buddy. I'm more disappointed in myself for not carrying out a compression test beforehand, apparently it's an absolute must on these cars due to the nature of how hard people drive them.

I really hope so too, I'm expecting to have a discussion with AT tomorrow to see what my options are following the Leak Down test. They also sent me the footage of the Bore Camera and the scoring they're seeing, I will see if I can upload a video to Dropbox and link it here.

I must say I am gutted, given it's my dream car from when I was in my early 20s and finally got the courage to buy one, not the best start to get off to but hey, that's life sometimes I suppose! :handsup:
 
#21 ·
Pretty sure that garage have already told you this and maybe even quoted amounts that you might not want to believe you have to start forking out yet :)

Whichever way you diagnose it, You will have to take that engine apart and blueprint it before deciding what to do.

You need to at least physically inspect cylinder 3 and it's components.
- Valves condition i.e. valve and/or valve seat not caked in carbon deposits and holding valve open
- Piston rings worn out
- Cylinder wall taper and/or out of round (oval shaped)

It will be any of a combination of these 3 things that cause that.

If you are DIY inclined, you are best doing these yourself.
 
#26 ·
Hello all,

Thanks to those that have replied already with their responses.

So I picked up my Evo from Auto Torque today and had a lengthy chat with the owner to discuss the results of the Compression Test / Leak Down Test, here's the results:

Cylinder Compression:

Cylinder 1 - 9.5 bar
Cylinder 2 - 8.5 bar
Cylinder 3 - 10 bar
Cylinder 4 - 8.9 bar

Cylinder Leak Down:

Cylinder 1 - 20%
Cylinder 2 - 30%
Cylinder 3 - 5%
Cylinder 4 - 35%

Flywheel: +/- 5%

NOTE: Scoring on bores 2 & 4.

Based on these results, I was advised that continuing to drive the car would result in further damage which would obviously end up being more costly!

In order to fully diagnose the extent of the issue, we would need to strip down the engine and the likelihood is that a rebuild will be required which would consist of some of the following:

- Remove Engine
- Strip Engine & Ancillaries
- Clean Internals
- Rebuild Engine
- Refit Engine and Run In
- Pre Dyno Check
- Rolling Road Remap
- Build up Custom Oil Cooler
- Upgrade Fuel Pump (Optional)
- Machine Work to Block, Deck and Bore
- Machine Work to Head if Needed, Cut/ Re-seat valves, skim face, fit guides

Depending on parts and brands used and how solid I want to build the engine (500hp+, 600hp+, 700hp+) the costs could vary between £6k - £12k :thumbdown :cry: :eek:

This is clearly the most disappointing news to hear and I almost feel sick about the whole situation, I can't believe this is the case.

I will likely call another Evo garage and ask them to carry out the same Compression / Leak Down Test, not to undermine AT's results but just for peace of mind, it would be interesting to see if the results match.

In the meantime I don't really know what route to take, I absolutely love the car and after searching for well over 6 months for the car, I thought I had found the one, now I'm contemplating returning the car.

I've spoken with the garage that sold it to me and they have also requested that I get a second bunch of tests carried out. If the results are the same (which I'd imagine they will be) then the garage have said we can re-evaluate the situation and see what route to take.

My only other worry is that as part of the Consumer Act, you only have 30 days to request a refund or a repair / replacement, as I purchased the car on 23/10/2019, that only gives me 5 days left to act!

If anyone has any advice or suggestions, their thoughts on the results mentioned above or can point me in the right direction, that would be absolutely amazing.


Thanks all.
 
#27 ·
Hello all,

Thanks to those that have replied already with their responses.

So I picked up my Evo from Auto Torque today and had a lengthy chat with the owner to discuss the results of the Compression Test / Leak Down Test, here's the results:

Cylinder Compression:

Cylinder 1 - 9.5 bar
Cylinder 2 - 8.5 bar
Cylinder 3 - 10 bar
Cylinder 4 - 8.9 bar

Cylinder Leak Down:

Cylinder 1 - 20%
Cylinder 2 - 30%
Cylinder 3 - 5%
Cylinder 4 - 35%

Flywheel: +/- 5%

NOTE: Scoring on bores 2 & 4.

Based on these results, I was advised that continuing to drive the car would result in further damage which would obviously end up being more costly!

In order to fully diagnose the extent of the issue, we would need to strip down the engine and the likelihood is that a rebuild will be required which would consist of some of the following:

- Remove Engine
- Strip Engine & Ancillaries
- Clean Internals
- Rebuild Engine
- Refit Engine and Run In
- Pre Dyno Check
- Rolling Road Remap
- Build up Custom Oil Cooler
- Upgrade Fuel Pump (Optional)
- Machine Work to Block, Deck and Bore
- Machine Work to Head if Needed, Cut/ Re-seat valves, skim face, fit guides

Depending on parts and brands used and how solid I want to build the engine (500hp+, 600hp+, 700hp+) the costs could vary between £6k - £12k :thumbdown :cry: :eek:

This is clearly the most disappointing news to hear and I almost feel sick about the whole situation, I can't believe this is the case.

I will likely call another Evo garage and ask them to carry out the same Compression / Leak Down Test, not to undermine AT's results but just for peace of mind, it would be interesting to see if the results match.

In the meantime I don't really know what route to take, I absolutely love the car and after searching for well over 6 months for the car, I thought I had found the one, now I'm contemplating returning the car.

I've spoken with the garage that sold it to me and they have also requested that I get a second bunch of tests carried out. If the results are the same (which I'd imagine they will be) then the garage have said we can re-evaluate the situation and see what route to take.

My only other worry is that as part of the Consumer Act, you only have 30 days to request a refund or a repair / replacement, as I purchased the car on 23/10/2019, that only gives me 5 days left to act!

If anyone has any advice or suggestions, their thoughts on the results mentioned above or can point me in the right direction, that would be absolutely amazing.

Thanks all.
To do those test would only take a small amount of time that could easily be done in your time frame.

Mark
 
#29 ·
Consumer rights act gives you 6 months. Don’t worry about time frame it has already been reported to the garage just keep everything to hand and correspondence by phone and backed up by email. I have experience when my ST spun its bottom end after 3days and took months to get a new engine sorted.

On a side note AT are very expensive and screwed me a while ago when completing a cam belt change. They got a tool stuck snapped it and made me pay for a new engine mount which luckily they had. Not their fault apparently blaming it on a piece of grit in the thread. Not a happy chap. I haven’t been back since!
 
#30 ·
Consumer rights act gives you 6 months. Don't worry about time frame it has already been reported to the garage just keep everything to hand and correspondence by phone and backed up by email. I have experience when my ST spun its bottom end after 3days and took months to get a new engine sorted.

On a side note AT are very expensive and screwed me a while ago when completing a cam belt change. They got a tool stuck snapped it and made me pay for a new engine mount which luckily they had. Not their fault apparently blaming it on a piece of grit in the thread. Not a happy chap. I haven't been back since!
Hi buddy,

Thanks for your response and sorry to hear of your previous experiences, it really sucks when stuff like this happens, I have to say it's the first time I'm experiencing this and typical that it's with my first Evo! :cry: :shake:

I went to AT as from what I read they're one of the best at what they do for Evo's etc. and being new to this scene, I didn't really know where to go and wanted a proper service.

Thanks again for your feedback.
 
#33 ·
Sorry to hear about the results that you have had from the tests carried out from AT. I would however get a second opinion. I have taken my Evo to AT in the past for servicing only. They are very expensive compared to others and although I’ve not had issues I know of others that have so now take my Evo to APTuning in Norwich. I can’t recommend them enough. I’ve heard MADevelopments are near you so there is another garage to use. With regard to you only having five days to sort this that’s absolute rubbish. You have contacted the garage in question and have made them aware so the ball is now in their court. Get another test done and then liaise with Wynford to resolve the issues.
 
#34 · (Edited)
Surely the key thing is that with any leakdown test you should be able to determine on a cylinder by cylinder basis the source of the leakage(s)? Was that kind of thorough analysis undertaken?

Furthermore, how come the compression test results now are so different to the ones posted at the start of this thread, in particular with regards to cylinder 3?
 
#37 ·
Surely the key thing is that with any leakdown test you should be able to determine on a cylinder by cylinder basis the source of the leakage(s)? Was that kind of thorough analysis undertaken?

Furthermore, how come the compression test results now are so different to the ones posted at the start of this thread, in particular with regards to cylinder 3?
That is interesting that you pointed that out as I noticed the same, the results are now different to what I was initially told. Apparently the leak down test was carried out last thing friday evening. I will call them back on Monday to understand why there's such a disparity.

Also I was told yesterday that around 10 bar is a good reading but when I spoke to the other chap about the initial readings he told me 12.

Let's see what they come back with Monday. To be honest I've read and heard different things so it's a bit confusing and not being a mechanic I'm struggling to understand what the "norn" is.

That's also part of the reason I was asking for anyone to share what is deemed the correct and expected compression for these 4G63 engines. For example out the factory and over time there would be an expected loss of pressure?

Thanks guys.
 
#39 ·
Thank you for looking, very kind but I really don't would not want to go down that route, I've not even owned the car a month.

If another compression / leak down test gives the same results and I need to go down the route of rebuild or replace then the car will either go back or I hope the seller will work with me to go down that route as I would rather keep the car.

Either way it's not looking great :shake:

What makes it difficult is I'm having to keep it hush from my wife as she'll kill me, she weren't too happy about me buying the car in the first place, now this!! :goingmad:
 
#41 ·
Strange results to say the least... the whole idea of a leakdown test is to discover where the compressed air is being lost... IE inlet valve, exhaust valve, head gasket, crankcase... you simply listen at the various openings and when you hear the leak obviously that’s the fault.
 
#45 ·
Interesting results,can I ask where the car was mapped?it is pretty well talked about recently that evo 9's are cracking the ring lands with higher boost and lean fuel settings.
It was a long time ago and the mapper in question as far as I know is no longer doing Evos.

Either follow Mark Shead's advice, but otherwise I would suggest APT near Norwich.
 
#46 ·
I am not really shocked nor surprised at that 'comprehensive report'. Is now even a report on huge BHP and money instead.

The cost of purchasing an IX MR at that low mileage aint worth it if you are to overhaul the engine already. Unless you intended to do so from the onset regardless of current state. Refund is what I would be promptly demanding. No ifs no buts. Alternatively seller offsets costs to overhaul that engine to an acceptable state.

Was in this position at the end of last year and I even took pictures for reference.

Your compression figures are similar to my own wet test results and mine were after more than a decade of use.

I wouldn't trust them bore scope images as they tend to exaggerate the depth and size of small things (debris looked huge in them).

If those compression figures are wet test, then the dry ones are horrible. Mine were 90+2 across the four cylinders.

The car drove alright usually but lacked power. The BOV, that usual emphatic oomph was gone.
Oil consumption was 0.5 litre across a service cycle and the vibrations on high load were what made me overhaul it.
Well that and a grandpa in a skoda passing me and angrily gesturing at me to move over :-O

I got quoted for those silly amounts by almost all garages and they even lost interest when I said I am looking to return the engine to OEM spec.

Those amounts quoted, I considered these as cheaper and better options for me:-

- Import 2 clean engines from Japan
- Rebuild my current engine myself x4 attempts with the added bonus of owning engine building tools and valuable experience at the end
- Import another MR and get rid of the current one
- Start with option 2 and then if at least attempt 2 is successful then switch to a new block on attempt 3, new crankshaft, new pistons

Option 2 and 4 and I don't regret my choice so far.

In the end the engine was to my pleasant surprise still within spec and only these really needed to be addressed:-

- Carbon deposits on valves and seats (they were non existent)
- Worn out piston rings
- Slight glazing at the bottom(piston slap area)
 
#52 ·
I am not really shocked nor surprised at that 'comprehensive report'. Is now even a report on huge BHP and money instead.

The cost of purchasing an IX MR at that low mileage aint worth it if you are to overhaul the engine already. Unless you intended to do so from the onset regardless of current state. Refund is what I would be promptly demanding. No ifs no buts. Alternatively seller offsets costs to overhaul that engine to an acceptable state.

Was in this position at the end of last year and I even took pictures for reference.

Your compression figures are similar to my own wet test results and mine were after more than a decade of use.

I wouldn't trust them bore scope images as they tend to exaggerate the depth and size of small things (debris looked huge in them).

If those compression figures are wet test, then the dry ones are horrible. Mine were 90+2 across the four cylinders.

The car drove alright usually but lacked power. The BOV, that usual emphatic oomph was gone.
Oil consumption was 0.5 litre across a service cycle and the vibrations on high load were what made me overhaul it.
Well that and a grandpa in a skoda passing me and angrily gesturing at me to move over :-O

I got quoted for those silly amounts by almost all garages and they even lost interest when I said I am looking to return the engine to OEM spec.

Those amounts quoted, I considered these as cheaper and better options for me:-

- Import 2 clean engines from Japan
- Rebuild my current engine myself x4 attempts with the added bonus of owning engine building tools and valuable experience at the end
- Import another MR and get rid of the current one
- Start with option 2 and then if at least attempt 2 is successful then switch to a new block on attempt 3, new crankshaft, new pistons

Option 2 and 4 and I don't regret my choice so far.

In the end the engine was to my pleasant surprise still within spec and only these really needed to be addressed:-

- Carbon deposits on valves and seats (they were non existent)
- Worn out piston rings
- Slight glazing at the bottom(piston slap area)
Did you do the engine overhaul yourself? Sounds like you got a good result in the end.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
 
#47 ·
If you really love the car this is what you should do.

Purchase a decent usable ix motor a short engine will do to get you back on the road and run it as stock.

Put the other engine aside for now.

Enjoy your car, get some use out of it and then if you decide to go for the forged route etc, you have your original engine to build at leisure.

It's a win win situation. :smthumbup
 
#48 ·
Thanks for all your replies, I appreciate all the feedback given. :):thumbup:

In regards to purchasing another stock engine, I don't really have the knowledge to do the work myself or more importantly, the time, so most of those options aren't really feasible for me.

I went for a second opinion and had another leak down carried out, the result was very similar give or take.

Therefore the next stage is to strip the engine and as of now I'm working with the seller to have this work carried out, either the engine will be rebuilt and brought back to healthy "Stock" form or potentially forge the engine and upgrade some of the components.

I'll keep you guys posted on the outcome and developments.

Thanks again! :mitsi:
 
#49 ·
I went for a second opinion and had another leak down carried out, the result was very similar give or take.

:mitsi:
Was any attempt made during this second test to pinpoint whats'really causing the leakage ie valves, rings etc

But in general I think the course of action you are now following is the right one, and I very much hope you get a good outcome :)
 
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